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	<title>Comments on: An Army under siege</title>
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	<item>
		<title>By: vedant</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9398</link>
		<dc:creator>vedant</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 25 Jun 2008 12:19:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9398</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[well pls forgive me as am far younget to al the above ppl in age n experience who hav posted their views but i was like to say that yes 2day i do feel that our army is under siege..after interacting wit loads of special forces operatives n a lot of research,i come to this result that the indian army n special forces(para commandos,nsg units and rangers,marcos) are second to none in sprit and ability but lag behind by miles when it comes to equpitment...DRDO is doing a gr8 job but to b honest not good enough in some areas,starting from our basic equpitments such as combact gear r not even close to what other countries have,the avg combact soldier is stuck with a 5.56 INSAS riffle which might be a bit more accurate and user friendly then the 7.62 slr riffle that it replaces but dose&#039;nt come close to the firepower of a russian make AK 47 riffle which i personally feel to be a gr8 but outdated arm,a very small portion of our special forces have mp5,uzi,M-4 carbines,glock pistols at their disposal and al these arms are tried and tested favourated of special operation units all over the world..and this is just a small example....aircraft and tanks r issues that would take an age to explain,all i say is that the progress is their but its time to pick up the pace and do something!!!i know very well that weapon systems dont win us wars but yes i also know the increase out capacity and effectiveness,i hope i have not hurt anyone&#039;s feelings by this small write up but its just that i care ....thank u]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>well pls forgive me as am far younget to al the above ppl in age n experience who hav posted their views but i was like to say that yes 2day i do feel that our army is under siege..after interacting wit loads of special forces operatives n a lot of research,i come to this result that the indian army n special forces(para commandos,nsg units and rangers,marcos) are second to none in sprit and ability but lag behind by miles when it comes to equpitment&#8230;DRDO is doing a gr8 job but to b honest not good enough in some areas,starting from our basic equpitments such as combact gear r not even close to what other countries have,the avg combact soldier is stuck with a 5.56 INSAS riffle which might be a bit more accurate and user friendly then the 7.62 slr riffle that it replaces but dose&#8217;nt come close to the firepower of a russian make AK 47 riffle which i personally feel to be a gr8 but outdated arm,a very small portion of our special forces have mp5,uzi,M-4 carbines,glock pistols at their disposal and al these arms are tried and tested favourated of special operation units all over the world..and this is just a small example&#8230;.aircraft and tanks r issues that would take an age to explain,all i say is that the progress is their but its time to pick up the pace and do something!!!i know very well that weapon systems dont win us wars but yes i also know the increase out capacity and effectiveness,i hope i have not hurt anyone&#8217;s feelings by this small write up but its just that i care &#8230;.thank u</p>
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		<title>By: Gopal.Suri</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9116</link>
		<dc:creator>Gopal.Suri</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 16 Jun 2008 04:36:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9116</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This article in Business standard http://www.business-standard.com/common/news_article.php?leftnm=3&amp;subLeft=1&amp;chklogin=N&amp;autono=326234&amp;tab=r
Confirms what Chacko Joseph say&#039;s. Director general mechanised Forces is the culprit. To Quote Col (Retd) Ajai Shukla
&quot;The army&#039;s Directorate General of Mechanised Forces (DGMF), which must eventually okay the tank, is not impressed but key decision-makers are rallying behind the Arjun.&quot;

Subsequently the Article says

&quot;The head of the Pune-based Southern Command, Lieutenant General N Thamburaj, strongly backs the Arjun. On a visit to the Mahajan Field Firing Ranges in Rajasthan to watch his troops exercising, Lt Gen Thamburaj noticed the Arjun firing nearby. 

After walking across, he was invited by the DRDO team to drive and fire the tank. Half an hour later, the general was an Arjun backer; two holes in the target he aimed at testified that a soldier without previous experience operating tanks could get into the Arjun and use it effectively. 

Business Standard has evidence of many more such incidents. On June 29, 2006, the commander of the elite 31 Armoured Division, Major General BS Grewal, visited the Mahajan Ranges along with a colleague, Major General Shiv Jaswal. Both drove and fired the Arjun for the first time that day; the two rounds that each fired punched holes through targets almost two kilometres away (see picture). 

That same month, 43 Armoured Regiment, which is the first army tank unit equipped with the Arjun, pronounced itself delighted with the Arjun&#039;s firing performance. After firing trials in summer 2006, 43 Armoured Regiment endorsed: &quot;The accuracy and consistency of the Arjun have been proved beyond doubt.&quot; 

But the establishment was quick to strike back. Barely three months after that report, the commanding officer of 43 Armoured Regiment, Colonel D Thakur, was confronted by the then Director General of Mechanised Forces, Lt Gen DS Shekhawat. Eyewitnesses describe how he was upbraided for &quot;not conducting the trials properly&quot;. But in a career-threatening display of professional integrity, Colonel Thakur&#039;s brigade commander, Brigadier Chandra Mukesh, intervened to insist that the trials had been conducted correctly. 

In a series of interviews with the army, including the present Director General of Mechanised Forces, Lt Gen D Bhardwaj, and with the MoD top brass, Business Standard has learned that opposition to the Arjun remains deeply entrenched. This despite the soldiers of 43 Armoured Regiment declaring that if it came to war, they would like to be in an Arjun. 

Minister of State for Defence Production, Rao Inderjeet Singh recounts: &quot;I&#039;ve spoken, off the record, to officers who have gone through the trials. Even the crews (from 43 Armoured Regiment)… who have been testing the tank… I forced them to choose between the Russian tanks and the Arjun. 

I said, you&#039;ve driven this tank and you&#039;ve driven that tank (the T-90). Now mark them out of ten, which tank is better? And I&#039;ve found that the Arjun tank was given more numbers than the T-90 tank.&quot; 

With new confidence, the Arjun&#039;s developer, the Central Vehicles R&amp;D Establishment (CVRDE), is arguing strongly for &quot;comparative trials&quot;, in which the Arjun would be pitted head-to-head, in identical conditions, with the army&#039;s T-90 and T-72 tanks. But the DGMF continues to resist any such face-off. &quot;]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This article in Business standard <a href="http://www.business-standard.com/common/news_article.php?leftnm=3&#038;subLeft=1&#038;chklogin=N&#038;autono=326234&#038;tab=r" rel="nofollow">http://www.business-standard.com/common/news_article.php?leftnm=3&#038;subLeft=1&#038;chklogin=N&#038;autono=326234&#038;tab=r</a><br />
Confirms what Chacko Joseph say&#8217;s. Director general mechanised Forces is the culprit. To Quote Col (Retd) Ajai Shukla<br />
&#8220;The army&#8217;s Directorate General of Mechanised Forces (DGMF), which must eventually okay the tank, is not impressed but key decision-makers are rallying behind the Arjun.&#8221;</p>
<p>Subsequently the Article says</p>
<p>&#8220;The head of the Pune-based Southern Command, Lieutenant General N Thamburaj, strongly backs the Arjun. On a visit to the Mahajan Field Firing Ranges in Rajasthan to watch his troops exercising, Lt Gen Thamburaj noticed the Arjun firing nearby. </p>
<p>After walking across, he was invited by the DRDO team to drive and fire the tank. Half an hour later, the general was an Arjun backer; two holes in the target he aimed at testified that a soldier without previous experience operating tanks could get into the Arjun and use it effectively. </p>
<p>Business Standard has evidence of many more such incidents. On June 29, 2006, the commander of the elite 31 Armoured Division, Major General BS Grewal, visited the Mahajan Ranges along with a colleague, Major General Shiv Jaswal. Both drove and fired the Arjun for the first time that day; the two rounds that each fired punched holes through targets almost two kilometres away (see picture). </p>
<p>That same month, 43 Armoured Regiment, which is the first army tank unit equipped with the Arjun, pronounced itself delighted with the Arjun&#8217;s firing performance. After firing trials in summer 2006, 43 Armoured Regiment endorsed: &#8220;The accuracy and consistency of the Arjun have been proved beyond doubt.&#8221; </p>
<p>But the establishment was quick to strike back. Barely three months after that report, the commanding officer of 43 Armoured Regiment, Colonel D Thakur, was confronted by the then Director General of Mechanised Forces, Lt Gen DS Shekhawat. Eyewitnesses describe how he was upbraided for &#8220;not conducting the trials properly&#8221;. But in a career-threatening display of professional integrity, Colonel Thakur&#8217;s brigade commander, Brigadier Chandra Mukesh, intervened to insist that the trials had been conducted correctly. </p>
<p>In a series of interviews with the army, including the present Director General of Mechanised Forces, Lt Gen D Bhardwaj, and with the MoD top brass, Business Standard has learned that opposition to the Arjun remains deeply entrenched. This despite the soldiers of 43 Armoured Regiment declaring that if it came to war, they would like to be in an Arjun. </p>
<p>Minister of State for Defence Production, Rao Inderjeet Singh recounts: &#8220;I&#8217;ve spoken, off the record, to officers who have gone through the trials. Even the crews (from 43 Armoured Regiment)… who have been testing the tank… I forced them to choose between the Russian tanks and the Arjun. </p>
<p>I said, you&#8217;ve driven this tank and you&#8217;ve driven that tank (the T-90). Now mark them out of ten, which tank is better? And I&#8217;ve found that the Arjun tank was given more numbers than the T-90 tank.&#8221; </p>
<p>With new confidence, the Arjun&#8217;s developer, the Central Vehicles R&amp;D Establishment (CVRDE), is arguing strongly for &#8220;comparative trials&#8221;, in which the Arjun would be pitted head-to-head, in identical conditions, with the army&#8217;s T-90 and T-72 tanks. But the DGMF continues to resist any such face-off. &#8220;</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Jaideep S Sisodia</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9106</link>
		<dc:creator>Jaideep S Sisodia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 18:04:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9106</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dear Mr Banjara,

you never understood my statements.Very sad indeed that the discussion had to reach this stage but since you started with accusation its only fitting that a dustbin like you get what you deserve.I must say its better you did not ram you self into T-90.

Grow up Mr Banjara, this is a discussion board not a street fight we are here to discuss not accuse.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Mr Banjara,</p>
<p>you never understood my statements.Very sad indeed that the discussion had to reach this stage but since you started with accusation its only fitting that a dustbin like you get what you deserve.I must say its better you did not ram you self into T-90.</p>
<p>Grow up Mr Banjara, this is a discussion board not a street fight we are here to discuss not accuse.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Banjara</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9105</link>
		<dc:creator>Banjara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:58:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9105</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have anyway called you a liar. So, i guess, I need not react to your nonsensical statements.

All I wanted to Know was, how many IIT&#039;s are there in the Army. And I ram into a full fledged Idiot.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have anyway called you a liar. So, i guess, I need not react to your nonsensical statements.</p>
<p>All I wanted to Know was, how many IIT&#8217;s are there in the Army. And I ram into a full fledged Idiot.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Jaideep S Sisodia</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9104</link>
		<dc:creator>Jaideep S Sisodia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:56:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9104</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[This site has good info (though some of it is debateable)

I was not aware with these you get &quot;whimp&quot; freebies like Zero Knowledge the great Mr Banjar.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This site has good info (though some of it is debateable)</p>
<p>I was not aware with these you get &#8220;whimp&#8221; freebies like Zero Knowledge the great Mr Banjar.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jaideep S Sisodia</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9103</link>
		<dc:creator>Jaideep S Sisodia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:54:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9103</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Dear Mr banjara,

Get a life.

You have zero knowledge i repeat zero knowlege.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dear Mr banjara,</p>
<p>Get a life.</p>
<p>You have zero knowledge i repeat zero knowlege.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Banjara</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9102</link>
		<dc:creator>Banjara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:51:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9102</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[No what you wrote was &quot; am not taking sides put if chacko or banarjee just brush up their knowledge they would come to know the no: of IIT graduates and qualified officers in teh army chacko and banerjee would actually fall from theor chair.Poor buggers.
&quot;

That means you know it. What I asked was &quot;I would actually like to know the numbers.&quot;

You are lying.

Now, what has North East got to do with it?

You haven&#039;t teold me how will a infantry officer turned General know about fighting an Armor battle? 

Your claim &quot; continously courses run by army to sychronise both the arms so that they do not falter in combat roles. &quot; Back it Up!

I am reading your statements and then replying. Its you who are pulling sentences from no where and then not backing up!]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No what you wrote was &#8221; am not taking sides put if chacko or banarjee just brush up their knowledge they would come to know the no: of IIT graduates and qualified officers in teh army chacko and banerjee would actually fall from theor chair.Poor buggers.<br />
&#8221;</p>
<p>That means you know it. What I asked was &#8220;I would actually like to know the numbers.&#8221;</p>
<p>You are lying.</p>
<p>Now, what has North East got to do with it?</p>
<p>You haven&#8217;t teold me how will a infantry officer turned General know about fighting an Armor battle? </p>
<p>Your claim &#8221; continously courses run by army to sychronise both the arms so that they do not falter in combat roles. &#8221; Back it Up!</p>
<p>I am reading your statements and then replying. Its you who are pulling sentences from no where and then not backing up!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Jaideep S Sisodia</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9100</link>
		<dc:creator>Jaideep S Sisodia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:40:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9100</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Read my statements fully looks like you serieusly need some schooling.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Read my statements fully looks like you serieusly need some schooling.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Jaideep S Sisodia</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9099</link>
		<dc:creator>Jaideep S Sisodia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:37:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9099</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[My goodness you still havent understood my comments onn IIT&#039;s i said i knew quite a few who were from IIT and in the army.

I am shocked you have no idea what varientong is North east india is all about else you would have not asked me proof n stuff.Do know anything about it?

And on what basis are you making a claim of the knowledge on Army chiefs?how are you judging their lack of knowledge?

Get you facts right and then enter into a debate.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My goodness you still havent understood my comments onn IIT&#8217;s i said i knew quite a few who were from IIT and in the army.</p>
<p>I am shocked you have no idea what varientong is North east india is all about else you would have not asked me proof n stuff.Do know anything about it?</p>
<p>And on what basis are you making a claim of the knowledge on Army chiefs?how are you judging their lack of knowledge?</p>
<p>Get you facts right and then enter into a debate.</p>
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		<title>By: Banjara</title>
		<link>http://frontierindia.net/an-army-under-siege#comment-9098</link>
		<dc:creator>Banjara</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 15 Jun 2008 17:35:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://frontierindia.net/?p=1793#comment-9098</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Correction on (Then you lie about your.... before that US marines train with Indian Army , ...)
before that US marines train with Indian Army hence its the best and only Indian Army trines in varid conditions and &quot; continiously figting a battle in snow desert and jungle&quot;...]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Correction on (Then you lie about your&#8230;. before that US marines train with Indian Army , &#8230;)<br />
before that US marines train with Indian Army hence its the best and only Indian Army trines in varid conditions and &#8221; continiously figting a battle in snow desert and jungle&#8221;&#8230;</p>
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